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Merlin
Private 1st Class
Australia
42 Posts |
 Posted - 16 June 2010 : 17:51:09
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At this stage in the comps development I think that if a team can qualify, through whatever means possible, then that team should be at the nats.
If we start limiting clans to one per field or one per state then we would be missing out on seeing a lot of talent out on the field. In the case of last years nationals none of the top three teams (7th Death, Mysterious Soldiers or FEAR) came top of Laser Strike's comp. At the same time quality teams like the Necromongers would have missed out.
Keep in mind also, that there is a significant cost involved with running a national comp which will exist no matter how many clans are involved. The more teams who are paying registation fees the less money the hosting field will loose.
If we ever come to the point where there are too many teams applying then perhaps we'd have to revisit the issue but I can't see that happening any time soon.
quote:
I propose that we have a national registration of clan players. This would give players the right to vote for a state representative and to attend the state clan wars and if qualifying, the nationals.
All for having some sort of commitee but registation of players would mean that there would be lopsided voting... i.e the field with the most players would have undue influence.
Like I say, state based qualification will have to happen at some point but right now I'd prefer to see the participation of a broad group of teams and fields(even if they get hammered), over a small group of elite players. There are a lot of fields in Vic and Queensland for instance who are devloping clan wars and I would hate to see the more experienced teams from BFL, DDLS and LS keeping up and comming teams from those states out of the nats. The prize of being able to attend the nats is important for fields who dont have a large history with Clan Wars to be able to grow their own comps. I'm sure wide bay would be looking to attend this year?
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Zeus
Staff Sergant
Australia
427 Posts |
Posted - 17 June 2010 : 09:19:22
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| On the high cost topic, travel really hinders a field/teams ability to play nats. That's why I think 1 team per field otherwise the group of teams playing nats becomes full of that fields or states teams. Then there will be accusations of point feeding etc. Simply, 1 team per field with around 10 fields makes for a decent nats but having 10 teams from the host field against 9 teams from other fields is just asking for trouble. The interstate teams who spend c*** loads to play sit and watch what should be a local comp game. |
Shooter, oh yeah
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Edited by - Zeus on 17 June 2010 09:25:53 |
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Merlin
Private 1st Class
Australia
42 Posts |
Posted - 17 June 2010 : 10:40:31
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I agree that we dont want a scenario where the local teams outnumber the cumultive total of the interstate teams...
That being said, I dont think we want to have teams that genuinly deserve to be at the nats missing out because of an arbitary rule. At least not at this point in the development of the comp.
If 10 fields want to go to the nationals then thats great. Last nats we had 6 fields represented with perhaps 2 more thinking about coming to this years event.So if the respective field owners can get together and agree that a field which has a particuarly strong clan wars comp is able to field more than one team then I'm all for that. If the likes of BFL, DDLS and Red Baron want to send more than one team then great.
I want to see as many interstate teams as possible at the nats but I also dont want a situation where there are only 7 teams, with only 4 of them really having any liklihood of winning. Also, I think the length of time in the previous nats has been good... two whole days of games is IMO what we are looking for. Dont want to play 4 hours each day and spend the rest of the time at the movies, thats not what you're forking out all the money for. So I idealy I would like to see 14-20 teams at the tournament.
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Zeus
Staff Sergant
Australia
427 Posts |
Posted - 17 June 2010 : 13:19:13
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| How do we decide who "genuinely deserves" to be there? Its unfair that anyone can play, as long as they can get there. Its the BEST in the country so each field should supply their best team, not as many teams as they can. With around 10 teams total, it allows for one bush and one inflatable field which then allows for smaller operators to run the comp. With too many teams, more refs and more inflatables are needed to complete it all in 2 days. I don't want it to constantly go from bris to Melb year after year. |
Shooter, oh yeah
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Weapon
Private 1st Class
Australia
37 Posts |
Posted - 17 June 2010 : 15:11:23
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Zeus - Your local field owner will tell you who (which clans) can qualify for the nats. Your right, this is the best clans and players in the country. And to be the best you must beat the best. Would it be fair if either Mysterious Soldiers, 7th Death or F.E.A.R were not able to compete last year due to only allowing 1 clan per field? These 3 clans cleaned up and were the best in Australia last year. Surely it's not going to be a competition with Australia's best clans represented if this happens is it?
Also, you say one bush field and one inflatable/urban field with 10 clans. Well this is happening already as we have 2 groups of 10 clans totalling 20 clans at the nats. Why would we want to limit this sport....We want to grow and develop it... Out with less and in with more!!!!
Also, this does not even come close to a local clans comp... There are players from all over Australia....
BTW - If the travel hinders you....Dont come!! |
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Chewy
Private 1st Class
Australia
48 Posts |
Posted - 17 June 2010 : 15:37:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Zeus
3 - Absolutely, all guns should be scruitinised and tested (Raven and Myself played a heap of the Bush part of the QLD titles on Default (Short) range as not "everything" had been checked properly) but see answer above regarding scopes etc.
8 - That site was honestly an interesting choice for inflatables, WHITE walls. Should have just set it up outside, no rebound there. Just need to be organised so as to not play into the night.
This would not happen if the members of a certain team turned up at the time that was given to them for registration, which made us late 45mins. Instead of 12mins to start time. |
Chewy
Wide Bay Laser Skirmish
www.widebaylaserskirmish.com.au |
Edited by - Chewy on 17 June 2010 15:46:42 |
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Zeus
Staff Sergant
Australia
427 Posts |
Posted - 17 June 2010 : 16:06:32
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Whoa back there weapon, just putting my opinion across and having a healthy debate. No need for all the exclamation marks. So we're making this exclusively for the teams with the money hey? not everyone can afford to go down to Melb or come up to brisbane every year, especially to play all of your teams. I'm sure there some awesome teams out there who just dont have the dosh to fly down/up, pay for accomodation food etc to play nats and to feel like they are playing in a local comp, they deserve to be able to play at their field but with a bunch of teams from each field coming, they just dont have the MONEY (<--Again) and the resources to do it! Yeah all your teams did great last year and deserved to be there, must all have high paying jobs, rich mummy's and daddy's or a field owner with enough money to sponsor 3 teams and pay for all their costs. If my team don't win our local comp and win some sort of sponsorship then i WONT COME because i cant afford it. I've played with Trigger Happy (3rd 2007), couldnt make 2008, again money, and Necromongers who were equal third or fourth (I cant remember) Inflatables last year and should have been much higher in Bush but a communication error due to dwindling time (because of too many teams) lost us 10 points and forced a playoff with YOU ie WE BEAT YOU in points for bush and should have had a final spot overall! But the communication error cost us that spot. Anyway, in saying that we are up there and deserve to play NATS by your logic, but without sponsorship we wont be!
You want the top 20 teams for the Nationals, but now i'll ask YOU how do YOU decide who are the 20 best teams in the country. YOU can only pick your best teams but how do YOU know were they come in the COUNTRY? How does anyone know who has the best teams other than restricting it to the field picking their best and going from there. Should those 3 teams be not allowed to play, no they shouldn't, they need to beat each other for the spot! How do we know one team doesn't feed points to a fellow team to help everyone from their field to the top?
If the best from each field doesn't bring the numbers, then Top 2, as long as everyone can bring their top 2 and have the opportunity to run it so their teams dont have to travel every year!
I know its not perfect but i feel that is the fairest way to do it. Anyway, thats my side of the debate. |
Shooter, oh yeah
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Brat
Moderator
Australia
1060 Posts |
Posted - 17 June 2010 : 17:57:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Chewy
quote:
Originally posted by Zeus
3 - Absolutely, all guns should be scruitinised and tested (Raven and Myself played a heap of the Bush part of the QLD titles on Default (Short) range as not "everything" had been checked properly) but see answer above regarding scopes etc.
8 - That site was honestly an interesting choice for inflatables, WHITE walls. Should have just set it up outside, no rebound there. Just need to be organised so as to not play into the night.
This would not happen if the members of a certain team turned up at the time that was given to them for registration, which made us late 45mins. Instead of 12mins to start time.
I refer to the QLD Clan War topic that says 9AM
quote:
Originally posted by Chewy
State Clan Wars have been finalised!!!! Plans have changed but not much -
Date: Sat 12/Sun 13 June 2010
Place: Maryborough Showground, Pacific Highway, Maryborough
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Sun 9AM Bush Clan Wars
Lunch -
1PM Inflatable Clan Wars
Tidy and Pack away
Dinner and Presentations
Celebrations and Commiserations
Mon AM Pack up and go retreat
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Äta, Dricka, Sova, DOMINERA
SES members do not get lost! They get Geographically Embarrassed. |
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Weapon
Private 1st Class
Australia
37 Posts |
Posted - 17 June 2010 : 18:05:23
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Ok, i will try and make this sound nice for you so you don’t wet your pants and cry...you do sound a bit upset..
First of all, my exclamation marks were not intended to harm you. If they have, you should move back further from the computer screen you don’t want this to lead to future eye problems for you!
You should know that only 1 clan out of 5 that went to the nationals from here last year was sponsored by Laser Strike. The other 4 clans (whom dont have rich mummy's or daddy's) paid their own way to the nationals... Thats right they saved up for that with the money they make with their part time jobs. All the players out of the 4 clans that paid their own way (except 2 players) were full time students. I would really hope with budget airlines and with some serious detective work on cheap accommodation you might be able to save and represent in the nats etc.. You can get the specials like Jetstar Melbourne to Brisbane $69 one way. Also, some of the clans from here actually funded part their way via sponsorship from other businesses outside the laser skirmish industry. That's right they said " hey we are good enough and we have qualified... but we don’t have the money... and we have to pay our own way...so let's go and do something about it"... And guess what – They went out and got the sponsorship they needed to help fund their trip.
The easiest thing for you to do here is just win your local comp and get sponsored that way... You really don’t sound very confident in doing that however? Otherwise if your field permits you to go and enter. Save and plan for the event... Still got over 5months to go & save for it...
Also, you mentioned we should only have 1 clan represent from each state.. As mentioned previously this would not be the best clans competing in Australia. Look at last years results for proof - top 3 all from VIC. If we did limit it to 1 clan per state you still would not be in the nationals by the sounds of things.
Every particpating field at the nats will get the chance to host. The location will be changed each year state to state.. So get used to the travel! It might not be back at your home field for 4 years.
How do I know which 20 clans are the best in the country... I will tell you a secret you cannot share... I look into my crystal ball (kinda looks like an iphone) and I say “Mirror mirror on this ball...Who is the greatest 20 clans of all"... Suddenly the crystal ball rings... and threw this crystal ball I open up a pathway... to communicate with other owners discussing which clans are being represented from their fields...
Weapon
www.laserstrike.com.au
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Zeus
Staff Sergant
Australia
427 Posts |
Posted - 17 June 2010 : 18:42:07
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First of all, you failed, it doesn't sound nice at all. Exclamation marks indicate exclamation ie you were yelling at me. Merlin and I were having a civilised debate and i can see his/your side of the argument.
I never said best team from each state (If i did somewhere, sorry), i said best team from each field. Otherwise, we end up with only a few clans at nats.
Whether or not i sound confident of winning our local comp has absolutely nothing to do with this debate, does it? We may make it, we may not. We are up against LOF who we all know is one of the best in the country. You seem to assume that im desperate to play nationals, I'm NOT. Not when it is so lop sided. You know only 6-10 teams will be from other fields, allowing you to fill up at least 50% of the teams with your guys. Playing the odds says you'll win. Same with last year, you had the majority of teams.
I was never trying to change your mind Mr Weapon, just offering a different opinion and you start out with your attacks. I have the right to an opinion and the right to express it. You have the right to a civilised reply, so lets just keep it civilised an offer personal opinions instead of childish personal attacks.
All i need to know is i am better than you, at skirmish and general life. |
Shooter, oh yeah
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Edited by - Zeus on 17 June 2010 18:44:21 |
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